1985 Oldsmobile Toronado engine swap

[VBCSpangler]

I have recently aquired an 85 Toronado. It has an olds 307 V8 with the electronically controlled quadrajet. The piston rings are shot and I am planning on replacing the engine with a 68-70 olds 350. Should I use the factory electronic quadrajet and engine management system with the olds 350 or should I replace the management system with an older mechanical quadrajet?
Furthermore, if I were to run the factory ECM controlled carb, would it be able to properly operate the olds 350's with its increased power? The 307's hp output is rated at 140 while the 350's hp should be 300+ (4bbl high compression engine). I appreciate the input.

[Bonneville92V688]

IMO, rip all that electronic carb crap out, and do it old school. That electronic controlled carb crap is a pain in the ass. My Dad's '85 Chevy Van with the 4.3 4bbl had it, and we had nothing but trouble with it. Finally ripped it all out, and put a standard Quadrajet on there with a 1 wire electric choke, and the problems ended.

(I love my 215's simplicity... No wires under the hood but battery/power cables, spark plug wires, coil wires, 1 blower motor wire, and headlight harness.... that's about it.)

[VBCSpangler]

Here's some pics by the way:






Those are plugs from cylinders #5 @150psi and #7 @30psi (thats why its soaked in oil)

[GonneVille]

You're gonna have to pay some attention to that transmission, I think. They can handle more power than stock,but I'm not sure just how much.

[clm2112]

Should I use the factory electronic quadrajet and engine management system with the olds 350 or should I replace the management system with an older mechanical quadrajet?

If that were the only choice, I would lean towards loosing the computer controlled carb in favor of a properly calibrated plain Q-Jet. The E4ME's have issues of their own and getting one serviced sould be an issue.

Have you considered going to TBI ? That yields a better fuel economy and isn't that much more of an expense.

[Skippy1827]

I had an 85 Toronado Caliente...It drove real nice..Leather/Chrome... I miss it...It had a voice system that spoke when something was wrong...very cool.

[VBCSpangler]

The transmission has been rebuilt by a GM dealership within the last 10,000 miles. It is a TH325-4L, which I believe is most similar to a TH200-4R (correct me if someone knows better). The TH325 (earlier non-overdrive) was used in the same body with the olds 350, cadillac 368, and buick 231 turbo. Anyone out there have more info on this transmission?

I agree, going with the mechanical quadrajet sounds like the better idea. However, TBI sounds good, about how much would it cost to set that up?

Yea, this one has the "KITT" voice as well to tell me i need to turn my lights off or my parking brake is on, haha.

[clm2112]

I agree, going with the mechanical quadrajet sounds like the better idea. However, TBI sounds good, about how much would it cost to set that up?

As a kit from Holley, it's a little over $1000 with all new parts and a stand-alone ECM to run it. However, a little creative junkyarding can cut that to about 1/3rd that price. I'd use the TBI setup from a 305 or 350 C/K Pickup or full size van from the late 1980's/early 1990's. Adapter plate to mate the throttle body to the Q-Jet manifold is about $90. You'll need an electric fuel pump and a return line back to the fuel tank.

[willwren]

He just cruised by with some gunky V8 goodness in the back of his Dad's Isuzu Trooper (my trailer wasn't available). Included in the pile is a good quadrajet. I'll probably rebuild it for him before the project is done.

The quandary is how to get the motor out of the back when there's no room for my hoist, and no way to get it to his house now? Shoulda moved that over first, then got the motor.

Jordan


We tested something here at ZillaMotorsports. He's at home putting it to practice hopefully, and then will be by a little later for my hoist:


Gotta lower the rear so his engine STAND (not my hoist) can pick that sucker out of there, then come back with the empty trooper to get my hoist.




Not quite there......let's let some air out:


Sent him home with some blocks, both ramps, and my 11-gallon tank to re-air enough to get back over here to finish filling the tires and pick up the hoist (12 blocks).

A little creativity goes a long way. This is similar to how I got the motor for the Zilla off my trailer.

[willwren]

All set. My 2-ton folding hoist fits in the back of the trooper.

[00Beast]

Geez Bill, you never stop giving, do you?

[willwren]

Hey, no giving here. He can only BORROW the hoist!

[willwren]

UPDATE:

He's tearing some stuff apart. Not sure which engine, but he just came by to borrow a big socket. I figure each favor is worth a beer, so he's in 3 beers so far.

1. For the unloading idea with the ramps and deflated tires.
2. For loaning him my engine hoist.
3. For loaning him a big socket for his crank pulley.


All in 2 days! Just enough beer for a good breakfast.

[VBCSpangler]

Yea that socket worked, I was able to rotate the crank so I could remove the torque converter-to-flexplate bolts. I removed the the rest of the A/C stuff and disconnected most of the engine harness and vacuum lines. I have a considerable pile of parts in my garage now. Almost ready to yank that 307 out of there, just engine mounts, bell housing bolts, and exhaust pipe left to disconnect. I'll post up pics tomorrow when the sun shows up again.
The socket was for the 307, and I'll get my roommates to get me beer for you... like Old English 40s?

[00Beast]

Hey, no giving here. He can only BORROW the hoist!

I meant giving TIME, EFFORT, and ADVICE. Bill, i think you should be Pontiac Bonneville Club.com's Man of the Year

[TUFFBONNEVILLE]

i see gold paint
is that a olds 350 rocket

[VBCSpangler]

Here's the pics:
I visited All American Classics in Vancouver, WA and picked up an Olds 330 4bbl high compression engine (10.25:1) out of a 1967 Cutlass. Engine is rated at 320hp and 360ft/lbs. of torque from the factory.



here it is on the stand in my garage


Beginning removal of the 307 out of the car by removing radiator, shroud, and accessories


Removed carb and disconnected all hoses/wires/linkages


Disconnected flexplate to torque converter bolts after removing starter


I can't fit a wrench in the small space where the exhaust pipe connects to the manifold:


So I unbolted the manifolds from the head so the engine can lift off of them


These two motor mounts are all thats holding the original 307 in its place, I'll pull it out tomorrow.


My big parts pile:


I'll keep ya'll posted on my progress.

[VBCSpangler]

Oh yea, heres some wheels I was thinking of putting on the olds.

Pontiac honeycombs:


Pontiac rallys:


firebird turbo wheels:


buick rallys:


and olds SS-II or SS-III


I'm leaning towards the turbo wheels or the olds SS-II, what do you guys think?

[Ultra Boost]

I'm leaning towards the turbo wheels or the olds SS-II, what do you guys think?

IMO they are not going to look good. The FWD wheels have more offset on the back of the rim. RWD wheels will have more offset on the front of the rim causing the wheel to stick out past the body and look like a roller skate.

What I have seen that works well on these cars are wheels from a 4x4 S-10/Blazer, or Oldsmobile Bravada (keeping it all Oldsmobile). They have the correct offset and look great on those older FWD cars.

[willwren]

Nice pink totes you got for parts there. What's the deal, you couldn't get the blue ones?