Fuel Lines Leaking!

[spoiledred94]

Man those lines look bad, way bad. We don't use salt etc out here in portland when it snows the two days a year it does. If you plan on keeping the car I'd suggest replacing all the lines, fuel and brake as well as dielectric greasing all your underside connectors. That's just nasty Lesabre. I sympathize.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

spoiledred, this car spent 9 years bumping around western New York. And a few years basically sitting in a parking lot, being moved every month or two. It hasn't led the most sheltered life, but it has not been grossly abused either.

The long-term plans include replacing all the metal lines since they are just plain nasty. That will not get tackled this weekend, due to time/school constraints.

So far here is my list of parts/stuff to get:
Sender
Pump
Tank straps
(If available) nylon fuel hose
Fuel filter

Any additions/deletions?

I will try to document with pictures as progress is made.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

Ordered all that stuff, some of it dealer-only, such as the straps and associated hardware. Also the sender unit O-ring, since I read a thread [url]here[/url] about how the straps and O-ring are dealer parts.

Now that the parts are ordered, the leak is gone. It'll come back, though.

[Mechanical Mike]

How's the gas tank look?

There's a tool for removing the plastic lines, you'll probably need one.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

It has a fair bit of rust on the tank, especially around the straps. Those straps look like taking them down will kill them. Maybe spraying with some penetrating oil will make destroying the tank less likely. The tank is not leaking, yet.

That brings up the next question: is securing a spare tank a good idea? I'd not like to spend much more on this.

Also, it seems like those clips can be removed using pliers. Or should I buy/rent the tool? I had success with pliers when trying to change my fuel filter.

That reminds me, some spare fuel line should probably be on hand if it gets snapped when trying to change the filter.

[Red Rocket]

How's the gas tank look?

There's a tool for removing the plastic lines, you'll probably need one.

x2 on the tool. If you have very tiny hands or can somehow maneuver the pliers up into that small space, you're lucky. The tool would have saved me at least two hours.

[repinS]

I actually just battled pretty much the identical leak over the past couple days, just above the quick disconnect. Drip drip drip with the key/engine on, I discovered it while hooking up my high speed fan override :sad5:

Because of the fuel leaking out of the line when the car was off, I too noticed some extended cranking time (by about a second) before the car would start

With a little patience and contortionism, you CAN section in a piece of rubber hose - there isn't even any room to cut the leaky area, but with an ID of the hose large enough (escapes me... just had it lying around), you can slip it over and clamp 'er tight.

My dad helped me to replace the entire nylon line from just above the quick disconnect to the fuel filter inlet with this rubber hose. Definitely NOT the proper repair considering the rest of my lines don't look so hot, but it buys me some time. I gotta get to school somehow, and won't have time to drop the tank until the weekend at the soonest. I don't advocate it as a permanent fix, but if you're in a pinch, it should do. Sender's a $70 part at Canadian Tire (vs. $40 + ship + duty for a Spectra at RockAuto), just have to get by on this for now until I have time.

Get the tool too. My dad and I managed to mangle them clips with pliers... not very "quick" without the right tools.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

repinS, can you please post a picture of this repair? I'd love to see how you did it. Probably I will have to do the same thing.

And yes, I do have tiny hands. But I will look for that tool just the same.


The tank is being dropped this weekend with the help of my very gracious friends allowing me to gunk up their driveway for an afternoon, possibly a second if things do not go as well as they ought. IDK how I'm going to ever thank them for saving my tail.

Here's a picture of the underside of the tank.



It's not as bad as I thought it was, but it's still going to give some trouble.

[putertopia]

Tank comes down in 20 minutes with the help of a girlfriend to help you maneuver it w/ ~5 gallons of gas in it WITHOUT pulling the exhaust (on a 94 Ei anyhow). Pulling the exhaust wouldn't have been worth the time even if it did unbolt in my case. Only thing that was pain in the ass was the emergency brake line.

It turns out that WASN'T rust in my case - but a dent in the center steel outlet line. I'm ordering a new sending unit, O-ring, lock ring, and a new fuel line that I broke (oops lol). Be aware that you'll likely new lines - the one line I couldn't get off broke as forced it to break itself from the rusty steel line. I will try to post some pictures tomorrow.

[1337ssei]

where do you get the lock ring and o ring and what do they do?

[putertopia]

Lock ring clamps the sending unit into the tank (it spins counter-clockwise I THINK to come out), o-ring seals it so nothing can get in/out that you don't want in/out. I purchased both off of Rock Auto, and ended up just getting the Spectra sending unit. We'll see if it holds up or not. If it were the fuel PUMP, I would NOT cheap out. Only issue I'm having now is getting my hands on a fuel line (not the line that goes to the fuel filter). I will take pictures tomorrow and post them.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

I ended up getting the Spectra unit with the pump and sending unit as one piece. I'll see how it works. I still have the option of returning it if it proves a piece of junk.

I still need the lock ring. Kind of forgot to order that. Whoops.

Puter, I'll be glad to see your pictures.

[putertopia]

Probably should have done this as I took it out, but I didn't.

Make sure you disconnect the two fuel lines and breather line from the fuel pump before dropping if possible. There is some slack, and I had to do it in reverse, meaning that I disconnected the fuel lines from the fuel filter and fuel line, pulled the them out of the clip holding it to the frame, and they came down with the tank. The one was easy to remove, the other one... well I broke the connector removing it because it was so tough. Breather line should just pull off. Also, be sure you have the pump unplugged - also a lot of slack there, should be able to do that once you get the tank partially down. I just unbolted the two bolts towards the rear of the vehicle holding the straps on and that worked superb.

The locking ring holds the fuel sender/pump in the tank via clamping it in. There are no screws / bolts - you just spin it counter-clockwise (the lock ring that is). Once you get the lock ring off, the sending unit will lift right out. I recommend that you use compressed air and blow all the stones/dirt out of around the lock ring so it doesn't fall in your tank when you get the sending unit out. I had to use a standard (flat head) screwdriver and a hammer to lightly tap out the lock ring because it was rusted. Take turns on all three tabs lightly tapping them counter clockwise.

First step is to disconnect the filler hoses. The big one I had to disconnect on both ends because it was a bit tricky to remove w/ exhaust still up. They're just hose clamps. It would be easier if you could just remove them from the tank and let them sit up there. My biggest problem is that they got tangled in the e-brake line.


Disconnect the two fuel lines and breather - suggest wearing safety glasses and grungy clothes. I just disconnected the fuel pump, started it, and let it suck the pressure out of the line. Don't rev.:


What it looks like where the tank goes:


Where the fuel pump and sending unit belongs. Notice the three 'nubs' that stick out - they're what the lock ring slips under to hold in:


O-ring between sender and tank:


Fuel pump and sending unit:


Reason she was spewing fuel all over:

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

Thanks for posting those up! Those are some excellent pictures!

And your lines are in MUCH better shape than mine are in. Probably I will have pinhole leaks in the main fuel line once I get full pressure back. Likely the combination of the OEM filter and the leaky connector have babied the rusty metal that used to be fuel line.

Probably the new Intense PCM being installed after everything is back and working with the stock PCM will hasten the death of those lines.

[putertopia]

So for whoever said they forgot to order the locking ring, they come with the sending unit. I ordered a sending unit, locking ring, and o-ring. I got a sending unit that came with an o-ring and locking ring, got a locking ring that came with an o-ring, and I ordered an o-ring, that came with an o-ring lol. All in all, I have 3 o-rings and two locking rings :D.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

I'm glad I didn't order the locking ring, because my sender and pump unit came with a ring. Also came with an O-ring much flimsier than the OEM one I ordered. That sender and pump together is about $165 at Advance, and is honestly the cheapest way to go when doing both. I had an issue with the strainer not wanting to stay connected to the pump, but a bit of superglue helped hold it in place during assembly.

My biggest problem was rust. Despite being 2 years newer and having less than half the mileage of puter's Bonne, my LeSabre was incredibly rusty, and a lot of time was wasted in fighting rust. Seafoam Deep Creep was my second best friend tonight besides my friend Brian who gave up his time and garage to help me. I had to cut the fuel filler lines clean off, and spend a lot of time fighting the quick-connects that were rusted onto the old sender unit. Also, the straps were deemed too rusty to re-use with the tank once the tank had been taken down (we ended up dropping the exhaust and completely owning the shield right underneath the tank, may fix that if it rattles), so yet more time was wasted in getting the pins out of the old straps, because I had forgotten to order them when at the dealer. And we had to make an emergency trip to Advance for fuel filler hose. Ended up using a universal radiator hose with metal inside (taken out before installation) that we trimmed to fit for the big filler hose, and some regular heater hose for the vent hose. New worm clamps all around. Some motor oil spread onto the pipe necks and inside the tubes made re-assembly a snap.

As for the sender, that was my problem. Something rusted through in the fuel line coming from the sender, and leaked a little bit. The car fires right up when I hit the ignition, and there's no gas smell anymore. Plus it's responding to throttle input like a champ now that it has better fuel pressure. I still need to have a shop do the fuel filter, because I cannot get that to budge, despite trying 2 different penetrants at different times.

Total cost for parts: $290. Time: 9 hours. Not having a fuel leak (so far, knock on wood): priceless.

[Red Rocket]

Glad to hear that you got it fixed! The biggest problem with my old 94 (now puter's) was the rust on the quick connects as well. They are not fun to get off once they are rusted on there.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

Thanks!

Not in the least. My friend actually broke one off at the old sender unit and had to retrieve it with vise-grips. It was stupid stuff like that which made the job take as long as it did.

[putertopia]

The car we're talking about is a 94 . So in reality, your car is 5 years newer.

[LeSabre in Buffalo]

And it's still in worse shape fuel-line-wise. One of these years I'll get around to replacing those lines.