new owner of a 98 SSE, help with a/c please!

[jknight8787]

I am a first time owner of a ne 1998 SSE. Seems to have been taken care of. The issue I am having is when the electronic climate control is set for a/c it blows hot air. I tried to fill up the system with refrigerant but no luck. The gauge showed it was at 15 psi but after adding a huge can of refrigerant, it would never get above 25 psi. I did notice the compressor kick on while adding but still blowing HOT air! I also noticed the compressor is making a slight squeeling noise after adding refrigerant, which i did not notice before. I am expecting ill have to replace the compressor, but was looking for any insight.

Another issue im having is that no matter which vent I set the control at I only get air from the floor and defrost vent. From resesrch it appears to be the air blend actutator has gone bad, does that sound correct??? Any help would be greatly appreciated as it currently 100 degrees in S.C and I need to get these issues fixed asap, and woyld like to know what im talking about before I bring it to a mechanic.

[nos4blood70]

The air flow problem is definitely the actuator. I'm afraid I can't assist with the cold air problem.

[MKMike]

1 large can is probably just not enough and the gas was probably leaking out as you added it.
Not only does the system require a rather precise amount of refrigerant but there needs to be a very specific amount of oil in the system to maintain the compressor and its seals.
The cooling is going to suffer whether there is too much or too little of either.
To get your AC to cool properly, you need to figure out where the leak is.
The most frequent places for leaks on any car are the Schrader valves where you hook up the gauge set to the high and low sides and the O-rings which are present wherever a hose connects to anything.
The gauge on the Freon can isn't going to tell you how well the compressor works or if there is a restriction in the system.
You need a manifold set with high and low side pressure readings.
If there is a reliable place with good AC mechanics, it may be worthwhile to have them locate and repair the leak, then vacuum down the system and refill it with the right amounts of refrigerant and oil.
If you have a vacuum pump and know how to safely work with refrigerants, then it would save money doing it yourself.
The easiest way to locate a leak (other than if there is some oil-soaked fitting) is with a special fluorescent dye and a black light.

[RJolly87]

I would also be concerned with the squealing noise you mentioned. It has been said that these compressors like to fail and leak from the bearings.

[MKMike]

I would also be concerned with the squealing noise you mentioned. It has been said that these compressors like to fail and leak from the bearings.

Good catch!
I missed the part about the compressor noise.

I've been too lazy to put a new compressor in my 98 SE but, if bearing failure is a common problem, then you may have just motivated me to get working on it.
I don't want to be stuck somewhere due to a seized bearing.

[jknight8787]

Thanks for input guys. I got a quote of $630 to fix the a/c, I.e compressor and whatever else required when doing the job. Does tbat sound reasonable???

[MKMike]

Repair pricing is always tricky because of the variables.
The problems are that we don't know what parts they will be using;a junkyard compressor,a rebuilt compressor or a brand new ACDelco or Delphi compressor
We don't know what typical labor rates are in your area; a NYC shop will be much higher than a shop in Nebraska
You can go to a website such as AutoMD and get a good idea.

$630 might not be bad if the compressor is the problem and the shop will install a brand new ACDelco compressor.
If there has been no assurance that the compressor will be replaced and that the replacement will be a brand new ACDelco compressor, then it may not be a very good deal.

[jknight8787]

So I replaced the air mix actutator today and calibrated it as instructed by setting to 90 degrees and reattatching the arm for the blend doors new pisition. My question is I noticed the arm move when I set it initially set it to 90 but after I reattach the arm and chage setting to 60 it apears it doesnt move, however the vents do work properly now. While doing this job I also believe I may have fixed a collapsed nipple by bypassing the connector as well.So does the vacuum line have anything to do with the vents or does it sound like the actutator works properly considering the vents work now. Just not sure what the actual cause of the fix was. The ecc was also blinking after I did this, if tgat means anything.

[jknight8787]

Good point mike. I will look into what you are saying about new or used parts. I am in SC and it seems like most places are charging close to 300 for labor if I supply the parts, which I found for 240 for ac delco new compressor, orfice tube and accumulator. Is it possible there is just a leak and that the compressor itself may still be good? The pully and clutch spin when its turned on.

[MKMike]

Good point mike. I will look into what you are saying about new or used parts. I am in SC and it seems like most places are charging close to 300 for labor if I supply the parts, which I found for 240 for ac delco new compressor, orfice tube and accumulator. Is it possible there is just a leak and that the compressor itself may still be good? The pully and clutch spin when its turned on.

Yes, it is definitely possible that there is just a leak at an o-ring or elsewhere but I trust RJolly87's experience.i
It will save you trouble (and future money) to replace the compressor now.

When compressors fail internally, they send bits of metal throughout the AC system---requiring replacement of the orifice tube and accumulator--and I've read that the condenser should also be replaced at that time---PLUS the system then needs to be chemically flushed.

The surface of the evaporator can get very clogged with dirt and debris over the years.
The reduced airflow makes your AC much less efficient.
Some people do this http://www.pontiacbonnevilleclub.com/fo ... c2431.html

When I bought my 93 SE it was missing the AC compressor and I decided to replace the entire AC system myself.
I was very surprised when I removed the evaporator cover and found this
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62751362@ ... otostream/

This was the upright view of it
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62751362@ ... hotostream

The debris had been packed in there for so long that it rusted a hole through the metal evaporator cover.

No idea whether the evaporator was leaking or not, since I installed a new one.

A good idea is to add a fluorescent dye to the system, so any leaks will be more easily found.

[jknight8787]

Thats unbelievable about the debris in the evaporator. I will take it to a shop to check for a leak, I just dont see why when I bought one of those cans of refrigerant that has the guage on it, it showed 15 psi and while filling it went to 25 psi quickly but wouldnt get an higher no matter how much I seemed to add.

[MKMike]

25PSI is not super low and the disposable gauge is so cheap it may be inaccurate.
AC technicians and better home mechanics use manifold gauge sets, even the inexpensive sets sold at Harbor Freight, which show the high and the low pressure side readings and are expected to be more accurate than the ones on a throwaway can.

Assuming the reading was accurate, a leak or the need for more refrigerant would also explain why the pressure remained lower than it should be.
These 2 articles should help you to understand AC better:
http://www.aa1car.com/library/ac98.htm
http://www.aa1car.com/library/ac_no_cooling.htm

You will often see a bunch of dirt at the place where there is an AC leak because the system oil can get pushed out with the refrigerant.

[RJolly87]

I also believe the '98 uses a variable displacement compressor, which is intended to keep the system pressures where they should be in a varying range of conditions, and minimize drag on the engine to only what is necessary.

It's also one of the reasons you need a gauge set, so that you can see what the entire system is doing to ensure proper operation.

[Sirius]

So I replaced the air mix actutator today and calibrated it as instructed by setting to 90 degrees and reattatching the arm for the blend doors new pisition. My question is I noticed the arm move when I set it initially set it to 90 but after I reattach the arm and chage setting to 60 it apears it doesnt move, however the vents do work properly now. While doing this job I also believe I may have fixed a collapsed nipple by bypassing the connector as well.So does the vacuum line have anything to do with the vents or does it sound like the actutator works properly considering the vents work now. Just not sure what the actual cause of the fix was. The ecc was also blinking after I did this, if tgat means anything.

The blend door mixes the chilled air (or heated air in cold months) with ambient air to control the temperature of the cabin air - it has nothing to do with where the air comes out. The vacuum controls do that, so it's likely repairing the collapsed nipple cured that problem. If the volume of air coming out of the vents is low, that's typically a symptom of the evaporator cloggage mentioned previously.

If your blend door is not moving and is set at 90*, you're probably still blowing hot air into the cabin. If you set your ECC at 65*, and your compressor kicks on does one of your compressor lines get cold? If so, your compressor is probably OK (squealing noise not considered) and you still have issues with your air mix. As for adding refrigerant, I let a shop that has proper equipment take car of that. They can install the correct amount and check for leaks.

[jknight8787]

Ok, so I replaced the compressor, drier and orfior tube after I replaced the broken air mix acutator and am still getting hot air. So I looked and even after replacing the actutator, it does not move when I set hot or cold. Its always stays hot. So I unhooked the actutator arm and manually moved the door to the left and I get instant cold air when set to ac.

I bought the actutator new from rockauto, its made by dorman. Is it likely defective???Figures this would happen considering that changing the actutator was extremely frustrating and now I have to do it again. Any ideas on why its not working properly??? During install I plugged the hvac programer into the actutator then installed the arm into the vent door. Then reconnected the battery, turned on ecc and set heat to 90. It moved slightly, so I calibrated by disconnecting the arm again and then put it back in place so now the arm extends a 1/4 inch to the left of the fastener that holds the arm in place. Did I do so ething wrong cuz I thought I followed instructions to the T.

My other question is when the air is off its easy to move the vent door but as soon as I turn on the air, hot or cold, it shuts back to the right . Its like it vaccums shut,so I had to rig it by sticking a wrench in there to keep the arm to the left so I can get a/c since its been 100 here in SC. Could I cause any damage by riging the door to stay to the left??? Also my ecc still blinks when I first start the car ever since I replaced the actutator. I did disconnect the battery during that install but its been weeks and I feel ive got to be close to 50 starting cycles by now.

Any suggestions. This has been a headache. I just spent a lot of money replacing the compressor and such . Thanks

[jonnevilleSSEi]

Rockauto could be the problem… I purchased a headlamp housing/lens once for the 99 Regal, they projected an inverted "V" pattern. I didn't like driving behind a floating upside down V on the right but a normal ellipse of illumination on the left so couldn't use the thing and went back to the factory original in spite of the frosted looking region on the lens. They replaced it with another lookalike brand, similar results. They have some great prices but they also have some junk. If you can get an AC Delco that could be more reliable.

I replaced (must credit Pete for doing most of the work, you don't know Pete). It was (looked like) a job for a double jointed contortionist but I've heard far easier/faster once if you know how to do it. Good luck, as long as the arm is working when you connect a new one it should move the blend door arm and start cold air. Do I recall that being air pressure actuated? Was a while back… Do you know if air pressure is making it to the actuator correctly? I had to replace my B/D actuator and compressor, now Bonnie Blows nice and cold (if I ask nicely). Good luck.

[Sirius]

I bought the actutator new from rockauto, its made by dorman. Is it likely defective???

It is certainly possible. Have you disconnected the blend door arm and set the ECC temp to both extremes and watched the arm on the actuator? It should move quite noticeably when you do this. If it does not, something is amiss and I would point a finger at the new airmix actuator, or maybe the electrical connection on said actuator.

Murphy's Law would support a faulty actuator since it is a most miserable task to replace.

...I had to rig it by sticking a wrench in there to keep the arm to the left so I can get a/c since its been 100 here in SC. Could I cause any damage by riging the door to stay to the left???

Nope. Somewhere on the forum is a post on a temporary solution to replacing the airmix actuator in which someone used a piece of heavy wire (coathanger) to manually adjust the blend door. Certainly not a permanent fix, but it provides a way to get hot or cold air as needed.

Also my ecc still blinks when I first start the car ever since I replaced the actutator. I did disconnect the battery during that install but its been weeks and I feel ive got to be close to 50 starting cycles by now.

There is a way to retrieve the code the ECC is throwing (that's why it's blinking), but I think you need a particular reader to do so. It's been too long for me to remember how to do it. Might be worth reading the code before condemning the new actuator (although I think that is the source of the problem). While my money is on your airmix actuator, there is a slim chance you may have something else on the fritz and the code might give you a clue. It would really suck to replace the actuator again and still have the same problem!