Starting Issue

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:05 am

Hey guys, having a bit of an issue with my parents' '00 Bonneville SE and could use some ideas....

The car has around 189k on it and finally decided it needed a "break" last week. Before this break, the car seemed to run fine (had its fair share of issues, don't get me wrong), but we were looking to replace the belt tensioner and the serpentine belt anyway. Well, we took the old belt and tensioner out and everything seemed fined in terms of the reinstallation (we double-checked everything), but when we went to turn the car over, it did not want to start up. It seemed as if the car didn't have enough power...

Turning the ignition, the car seemed like it wanted to go and the belt appeared to move fine, but it would only crank for about 2-3 seconds and then stop suddenly and there would be a noticeable squeak. The next time we tried, it appeared that the car had even less power so we would wait a bit and after trying for a third time, the same thing would happen as the initial attempt. We postponed any more attempts after this.

- Now saying all this, here's what our thoughts were; the squeaking may have been caused by some coolant getting on the pulleys while we were disassembling the belt tensioner. The squeaking doesn't seem to be as present as it did before when we try starting it.

-We checked the battery and it did appear that replacement is in the near future so we hooked it up to charger and gonna see if that's enough to jump start the car. No attempt yet.

-The only other things that came to mind was possibly the timing of the engine being off, but I'm not completely sure how to check it on this vehicle or if a belt change/belt tensioner replacement would cause a timing issue.

So that's my story. Any thoughts or comments on what we should look for, change, possibilities, issues, etc., would be much appreciated. We would like to get this car back on the road as soon as possible. Thanks again for the help everyone.

crash93ssei · Post by **crash93ssei** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:09 am

Charge the battery then try again.

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:11 am

Update: My dad got the battery charged, tried starting it, and said it didn't turn over, but sound "like it wanted to." Still had the squeak sound.

He did mention a small smell of rubber possibly. Could the belt be too tight? When we were moving the tensioner to put the new belt on, the bolt holding the pulley on, slipped. Could we have overtightened it? I'll have my torque wrench this time so I'll make sure its at ~37ft/lbs.

crash93ssei · Post by **crash93ssei** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:54 am

Any chance for a video of the squeak sound?

If the belt went around the tensioner and all other pulleys then there is no way it is too tight. Even if it was too tight I doubt there would be enough resistance to prevent it from starting. Maybe the belt routing is wrong and it is rubbing on something?

If there was any rubber smell when he was trying to start it it can't be the belt unless it is rubbing against something or trying to spin on a frozen pulley, and even then it would take more then a few seconds.

Possibly battery cables getting hot and smelling?

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:00 am

I'll see if I can get a video of it tonight. Thanks again for the help.

00Beast · Post by **00Beast** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:48 am

Take the belt off and try to start it. If it starts, it's something on the belt path. Don't let it run too long sans belt though. First rule of diagnostics, rule out the thing you just did...

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:55 am

Thanks for the help guys. I'll see what we find out tonight.

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:22 am

Well did some more work on our poor '00 Bonneville SE and would say we got a bit further, but the engine is still struggling pretty bad. Additional work we did last night was had the alternator checked, checked and charged the battery (again), replaced some of the spark plugs, and checked the spark plug boots and wires. At first the engine wouldn't start (also no RPMs showed on the dash), but in our last attempt, we did get it to run on its own, but it still had a high pitch sounding squeak with it along with a burning smell. I was as concerned with the burning smell as this engine is in need of some new gaskets so there's some build up, but the squeaking sound is what is puzzling me. We are kind of at a stand still of where to look at this point....

I recorded how the engine sounds so here is the YouTube link for it. Please let me know what you think, thanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqS08kTf ... e=youtu.be

Post by **Archon** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:37 am

Did you try it with the belt off? Try disconnecting the MAF? Part of the smell could be the starter over-heating. It really shouldn't be cranked that long at one time, and then should have an extended rest period to cool off.

Post by **harofreak00** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:47 am

In the video I hear the very distinctive sound of a bad bottom end. I'd rule this engine as "done".

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:57 am

We did try it with the belt off at the start last night and at that point it did not run on its own. After changing out some plugs and charging the battery again is when it ran on its own for that short time.

We can test out the MAF next. How would we know that is the deficient part or what do we look for? Could that possibly cause the squeaking noise?

Sadly, that video was of it running...

Post by **harofreak00** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:00 am

Sorry to say, but its not a MAF issue. The squeak is internal. It probably spun a bearing and isn't getting proper oil flow. The motor is going to lock up very soon if you keep running it.

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:03 am

Yeah, that's kinda what I was fearing too. I was just hoping to get lucky I guess. Thanks again for the help guys. What would prevent oil from moving properly?

Post by **harofreak00** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:06 am

Oil flows through the crankshalf and is distributed to each crank bearing through little holes. When the bearing spins, causes that hole to get blocked and stop all oil flow to that bearing, further destroying the bearing.

Same issue here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hQQByPFPZI

crash93ssei · Post by **crash93ssei** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:15 am

Gonna throw in another opinion here, I 100% agree that the engine is smoked. Time to drop a new / used in or just sell the car as is.

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:42 am

Yup, sounds identical to our issue...

Gagger14 · Post by **Gagger14** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:12 am

How much do rebuilt/used 3.8s go for these days? Is there a thread that shows the installation?

Post by **harofreak00** » Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:49 am

You should be able to find a used engine with around 100k for $500-750.

PontiacBonnevilleClub.com

PontiacBonnevilleClub.com

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