brakes -> sle vs se 2005

[wrair]

SE - 15" wheels; ~11 inch front brake rotors
Sle - 16" wheels; ~12 inch front rotors.

So, my question is, are the 12 inch rotors and appropriate calipers really better? How - stop shorter or resist fade better? For the SE, it is easy to lock the brakes which cause the ABS to work, so is there any advantage to upgrading to the 12 inch front rotors (and perhaps appropriate rotors) assuming one has 16" rims?

Wondering whether this is a useful upgrade (need to do a brake job soon, switching to my 16" winter tires, wonder if I should go with the better brakes or whether it really won't give much improvement).
Thanks for input/thoughts.

[Merrillspontiac]

SE has 16" wheels

[00Beast]

00+ SE has 16's, SLE/SSEi has 17's. Yes, the brakes are worth upgrading.

[01bonneSC]

More stopping surface area.

[wrair]

Hmm. Maybe I am confused (what's new?)

But I've been scouring local junkyards (Crazy Ray's, a bunch in MD), and many Bonnies don't have their wheels on, so I've been measuring their front rotors. Somehow, I thought most were 11", rather than 12"; the latter being the upgrade from my perspective (having the 11" rotors). For the 12" rotors, 16" wheels are needed generally, but the car could have the 11" rotors with 16" wheels, just not 12" rotors with 15" wheels. Whew, say that fast.

So I was thinking of the 12" rotors upgrade, which would require the caliper bracket for that size. I got that from Crazy Ray's! I might have incorrectly assumed that the calipers were the same for cars with the 11" OR 12" rotor - which does not seem the case.

So... I need to get calipers. What is the thought of junkyard calipers vs parts store rebuilt units?

Finally, kind responders wrote: "Yes, the brakes are worth upgrading." and "More stopping surface area." Is there quantitative data available? A write up (probably not), at least could not find with the 'search')?

Since I need a brake job soon, I thought I'd upgrade, but it seems more parts than I originally thought. Might be a holiday gift to myself....

Totally unrelated to this thread, I recently added a rear sway bar and center brackets from Crazy Ray's, new endlinks (Moog); and holy Batman, what an improvement!

Again, thanks.

[01bonneSC]

If you google "Will bigger brakes improve my car stopping?", you shood be able to get the data.

There are people who run 16" steelies with winter tires on SSEi's. GXPs will need 17" steelies at the minimum. They have bigger brakes.

[cprince]

There was an upgrade that a lot of the Grand Prix and Impala lads were doing where they upgraded the calipers to (I think) Camaro ones with a bracket mod of somekind... and went to the larger rotors.

Common upgrade...

I am not that well versed in the ways of the Bonni to say if they do it with our rides or not...

Craig

[nos4blood70]

Bonnie drivers have done the F-Body brakes too. They are an upgrade for SLE/SSEi owners.

[00Beast]

Well, they're an upgrade for everyone, lol. All SLE/SSEi owners need is the calipers and the pads, SE owners need to add SLE/SSEi rotors to that as well.

[wrair]

I'm still investigating this, but my "plan" was to stick to the SLE/SSEi upgrade - rotors, caliper bracket, and I am still investigating whether I need to switch calipers. Not the F-body brakes!

What is the thought on junkyard calipers?

[00Beast]

What is the thought on junkyard calipers?

Idk, do you really trust something that's been sitting out in the weather, potentially for months?

[01bonneSC]

You could use em for cores if you want, but I wouldn't trust em without a FULL rebuild.

I think the biggest thing that helps are stainless braided lines. That rubber deflects and the stainless doesn't...well, less.

[00Beast]

Not only is it more surface area, and more leverage against the wheel. Think about using a longer wrench on a tight bolt. Technically SSEi rotors are 11.9" in diameter.

SE's came stock with 16" wheels, either steel or aluminum. SLE's and SSEi's got 17's, only in aluminum. But yes, 16" wheels will fit over the stock SSEi brakes. They will also fit over the F-Body caliper upgrade as well.

[01bonneSC]

Not only is it more surface area, and more leverage against the wheel. Think about using a longer wrench on a tight bolt. Technically SSEi rotors are 11.9" in diameter.

Great analogy!!!

[BonneMe]

Upgrading brakes can accomplish a few things, but lessening ABS, or helping in winter isn't one of them. Even the worst H body brakes can be more than enough stopping power for a stop or two in a row from high speed. ABS only kicks in when a wheel locks up, so the only way to lessen that affect is to add more grip (appropriate tires for the conditions/vehicle use) or be better with the pedal. ABS does a wonderful job of stopping cars in tricky conditions while maintaining steering control, the more grip you give it, the better it performs. Some people think they can outperform it and will disable the system, but that's a dumb idea.

- Larger rotors will really help you with repeated stopping as there is more surface area for the pad to work, and for the rotor to dissipate heat. They can offer more power as well, but they do get heavier.
- Calipers offer better modulation/feel for the most part, larger calipers and more pistons will generally improve performance as well, especially in tough conditions like a road track.
- Pad material affects A LOT, pretty much everything. Different materials build heat up at different rates, they work better in different heat ranges, they provide different "bite" in the pedal and on the rotor, they produce different levels of dust, etc. Getting a good pad is #1 IMO.

To keep your 16" wheels functional, I'd go with the SSEi setup, a quality pad, and a rotor that will withstand whichever pad you want to go with. There are many cheap rotor sets out there for the Bonneville, and spending an extra $20-40 upfront is much better than having to pull it all next year and replace a set of rotors again.

Also make sure your rear brakes are in good condition as well. If they're bad they'll cause problems for the whole system!

[wrair]

00Beast wrote: "Idk, do you really trust something that's been sitting out in the weather, potentially for months?" I see your point, and there is something that sounds stupid about going cheap on brakes as BonneMe indicates above. Then there is my frugal outlook - my calipers have been sitting out since 2005...and since they were originally owned by an old man (not me, of course!), they probably weren't exercised much since they still have the original pads/rotors. Time to do a brake job, hence my interest in this topic at this time.

Great comments! Thanks!

[crash93ssei]

I see no issue with junkyard calipers. If you buy a car that has been sitting for a year or two for you rush out and buy all new calipers for it?

My view on it - if the caliper looks to be in good shape with no rotting or cracking on the rubber piston seal and the bleeder screw can be loosened without breaking, then I wouldn't hesitate to install a used caliper.