PontiacBonnevilleClub.com

i cant locate one anywhere.. and would rather get a whole pump instead of just the pump repair kit..

dont know if the repair kit will fix all problems that can happen to the pump..

has anyone used a oil pump repair kit before.. does it fix an oil pump not pumping oil..?

Ok, the "oil pump" on the 3800 is built into the timing cover, it's not a seperate component like one on a Small Block Chevy or Ford.

The pump repair kits are three parts... the rotor on the crank snout, the rotor that spins in the timing cover, and the steel plate that holds both in place on the timing cover. Lemme scrounge around a minute and post a picture of what the "pump" looks like...might make more sense to you if you see the picture.

Edit: Ok, here's what the oil pump actually looks like (with the steel cover plate removed so you can see the two rotors.)



So to replace the entire pump with new parts, you would need the aluminum timing cover, a pump kit (for the rotors and steel plate), screws to attach the plate to the cover (creating the "pump"), and a new crank seal & gaskets. Make sense?

If this is related to your other thread on low oil pressure, then I'd hold off until you have proven you have low pressure at the pump, cleaned/replace the oil filter adapter & pressure relief valve in the timing cover, and if still no go, made sure the pickup in the oil pan isn't clogged up.

Failure of this style of pump is pretty rare...it takes a lot of clearance problems in the rotor teeth to make it puke so much oil that it can't put pressure to the system.

clm2112 wrote:Ok, the "oil pump" on the 3800 is built into the timing cover, it's not a seperate component like one on a Small Block Chevy or Ford.

The pump repair kits are three parts... the rotor on the crank snout, the rotor that spins in the timing cover, and the steel plate that holds both in place on the timing cover. Lemme scrounge around a minute and post a picture of what the "pump" looks like...might make more sense to you if you see the picture.

Edit: Ok, here's what the oil pump actually looks like (with the steel cover plate removed so you can see the two rotors.)

you would be like the best person if you could tell me how to fix it with the repair kit..
and is it something i could possibly do...

i've done vlave cover gaskets, manifold gaskets, fuel pumps, water pumps, oil pan gaskets power steering pumps..
stuff like that..

i would appericate all the help i can get with this.. thanks club...

so i should just get a oil pressure gauge first..?

or should i replace a certain part first.?

thanks.. i really cant wait to get this car up and running..

88bonnsse wrote:you would be like the best person if you could tell me how to fix it with the repair kit..and is it something i could possibly do...

To repair the oil pump on a 3800 you need to:

1.) Remove the oil filter adapter from the timing cover..this is the same place where the Oil Pressure Sender is screwed in. Also, inside it is the spring-loaded pressure valve.

Clean and inspect these parts before continuing. If they are sludged up, this is probably the real problem with no oil pressure.

Assuming they are in good shape and are not the culprit, keep going...

2.) Drop the oil pan off the bottom of the motor (take the oil level sender out of the side of the pan, then remove all the bolts around the rim of the oil pan.)

Clean the pan, and look up at the pickup & screen hanging off the bottom of the motor...another place where sludge or other trash in the pan can plug up the oil system and prevent the pump from picking up oil. (the pump sucks oil up out of the pan through that pickup tube.)

Again, assuming the pickup and screen are ok, then it's time to remove the timing cover/oil pump/water pump assembly.

3.) Remove enough of the accessories so you can get to all the timing cover bolts. Have those handy "Dorman" replacement coolant elbows handy...you'll need them to reassembly the timing cover and have working coolant passeges to the heater hoses.

4.) Remove the harmonic balancer

5.) Remove the bolts around the water pump and take off the water pump.

6.) remove the timing cover bolts, and take the timing cover.

7.) look on the inside of the cover and you'll be looking at the same picture you see above. sive countersunk hex screws (take them out with an allen key) and the plate comes off..revealing the pump rotors.

If I was you, I'd worry about the oil pump last. Do everything else first that has been stated to you already. Most are cheap or free, and just require some time under the car.

Oil pumps don't 'fail' on our cars.

If you have low oil pressure, look at the sender and internals of the engine first. There is no bandaid for this.

To answer your last question...

Get a gauge first!!! There's no point in going through all this if there's nothing wrong with the pump and you are just getting a bad reading from the pressure sender.

Continuing from my last post:

8.) Pry out the old crank seal off the front of the timing cover, and drive the new lip seal into the cover (Mallet and a block of wood). Grease the inside of the lip seal so it has some lubrication and doesn't tear on the harmonic balancer

9.) Take the new rotors from the repair kit, coat them in grease, and put them in the cover in the same orientation as the old one. Grease the inside of the new steel plate and reinstall the screws. (I'll have to check the torque value on them, but it's pretty low..like 9 or 10 ft-lbs.)

Now would also be a really good time to check the timing chain, tensioner, and the magnet in the cam gear that server as the cam position sensor....you're this deep into the motor, its foolish not to check this stuff before buttoning up the front of the motor.

10.) Start putting everything back together with new gaskets in the reverse order you've taken them off.


This isn't hard to do..hauling ass it's a couple of hours of work. But again, diagnose the oil pressure with a gauge before taking this apart. I'd hate to see you waste the time...especially if you are on a tight budget. (It's about $50 worth of gaskets to do this + pump kit and crank seal.)

Has this car sat for awhile?

I was reading on another forum that they had a problem with the pump not priming after the car sat for a long time (2 years). The other thing I saw was someone with a bad seal on the pick-up tube in the pan.

Should this be merged to here?

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=13349

I have never (since 2002 on this club) seen an oil pump fail or get weak. This is the most ridiculous remote possibility for the symptoms.

Our pumps self-prime quickly, and it's insane to try to swap one without the troubleshooting steps outlined here first. Your problem is:

50/50 either the sender or something internal to the engine.
.000001% the pump.

Please continue in your other topic as suggested.