PontiacBonnevilleClub.com

Hopefully crash93ssei will chime in here...

Some nice posts in the past few weeks of spring cleaning jobs. There are alot of really nice cars on this board. I've noticed a few folks are curious as to what's needed to do a decent job, so I'll offer my 2 cents. I did my first detail job in '79, so although I'm no expert, I've been at it for a little while..

A decision needs to be made about mechanical equipment from the start. Hand polishing will never achieve the results a mechanical buffer will, but a really nice job can be done by hand if the paint is decent to begin with. Light swirls and minor scratches can be removed by hand, but serious haze and swirl marks will require a buffer.

Stay away from rotary buffers. They are a pro's tool, and even a well-skilled amateur can cause serious damage with one. What is needed is a random orbital buffer/sander. Like anything else, you get what you pay for. You can buy a cheap one, but you won't get the results you're looking for and will buy a decent one eventually. I have a Porter-Cable, and couldn't be happier. They are one of the best consumer-grade orbitals out there, and fairly priced at the big home improvement places. Online prices might be better, but I never shopped for mine online (had it prior to the internet taking off...)

You'll need pads to apply your polishes. Polishing is what removes or lightens the scratches and swirls. Waxing only hides them by filling them in. Waxing is a temporary fix. Polishing rounds the edges of deeper inperfections, and removes a fine layer of clearcoat to eliminate the swirls and lesser defects. Some polishes contain fillers as well. To polish, you'll need at least two pads, a cutting pad and a polishing pad. I've had good success with the Lake Country line of pads, but there are others out there. They are color coded, with Lake's yellow a minor cutting pad, and the white are a polishing pad. There are others as well. The orange pad is a combo of the two, and black pads are for applying wax. Polishes are a personal preference, as are waxes. Polishing is the root of your shine.

Wax application and removal is better by hand, in my opinion. I'm sure there are other opinions out there. Two coats, with every wax job. Evens application, and ensures protection. Wax enhaces and protects the shine.

You'll need to prep the surface before you start. Wash the car with Dawn dish washing liquid first. Dawn won't hurt your paint. It will help to remove previously applied wax and minor gunk other washes won't. But it removes wax. Don't use Dawn unless you want to remove wax! Claybar the entire car. I jumped on the claybar wagon about five years ago and they remove tar and other contaminents polishing won't. It won't take long, and it definitely helps the finished result. But if you drop it, throw it away! You'll be sorry if you don't...

Wash the car with Dawn after each step, drying it with microfiber towels. I'm a big fan of the two bucket/two towel method of car washing, anytime I wash one. First bucket is for soapy water, second is clear. After washing a section, throw the towel in the clear water, and grab the second towel for the next section. You'll be amazed at how cloudy the rinse bucket gets, but how clear the soapy water stays. Try it, you'll like it!

What's needed??

R/O buffer/sander
polishing pads
polish
wax
microfiber towels

That's my two cents worth. My results are here. http://www.pontiacbonnevilleclub.com/fo ... =9&t=10955

Mark

Very nice writeup! Definitely a must read for those with questions.

I will add that the yellow Lake Country pad is the heavy cutting pad used mainly for sever oxidation, swirls, and scratches. I use mostly orange, white, and black (gray) pads in my detailing. I was going to pick up some yellow pads, but decided not to as I am going to pick up a rotary instead. A rotary buffer can do more with an orange pad then a orbital buffer can do with a yellow pad, but as said above, can easily damage paint if not careful.

I get all of my supplies on http://www.autogeek.net They have a great forum, much like our own with a family friendly atmosphere and they don't scald you if you ask a question that has been answered a dozen times before. They also have the best customer service I have ever seen!

Here is a link to the Lake Country CCS pads that I use Lake Country pads

You would want two to three pads per step or wash the one pad you have after about each 1/3 of your car is polished. They will begin to fill up with polish etc. and loose their cutting / polishing ability.

Later today I hope to have enough time to put together a little starter kit for swirl removal and amazing gloss

Wow thanks for all this info! I've been really wanting to give my car a great detail job this summer and wasn't sure on what to get and all that stuff.

Question do you just recommend getting the Yellow Lake Country Pad for decent swirls and some minor scrathes? Any specific type of wax and polish for that? Or recommendations on what kind of wax's and polishes you recommend.

The yellow pad is a good choice for removing deeper scratches with a more agressive compound like Menzerna's Intensive Polish. The orange pads are a better choice for more minor imperfections like swirls. If your car hasn't been polished in awhile, I'd suggest the yellow pad and the Intensive, and follow it up with Menzerna's Final Polish and a white pad. The Meguiar's NXT is easily available at most auto parts and department stores, and does a really nice job. I've spent money on some of the higher-end waxes in the past, and the NXT is right up there for a fraction of the price. If your finish is in decent shape and you're looking to remove just fine scratches and swirls, the orange pad and the Final should do the trick.

Mark

The yellow LC pads are very aggressive pads, unless you have some severe paint issues you should really stay away from them. Most scratches and swirls can be corrected with orange and sometimes even white.

Depending on what machine you are going to use for the correction will depend on the pads you use. If you have a PC or Megs G110, smaller pads work better, I have had more success with the 5.5 inch pads vs the 6.5 inch pads. If you have a good chunk of money and have the flex (great machine but $$$$$$$$) any size will do. The three pads I use most are orange, white, and black. Now the LC pads are either flat or they have these little dimples in them, I prefer the flat pads when using polishes with diminishing abrasives (ie Menzerna, Optimum, older Meguiars, and XMT). For non-diminishing abrasives like the Meguiars M105 and M205 I will use whichever pads I have on hand.

As for which polish and wax to use, that is personal preference. Most polishes will accomplish the same thing as the end result, it just depends on how well you are able to use it. Crash is a fan of the Menzerna line of polishes so that is what he will recommend. Don't get me wrong, they are great and I have them in my bag, but I usually dont use them as they are fairly expensive. Personally I use the Optimum line and M105/M205 combo depending on what type of correction needs to be done. One thing I have found is that these brands have all been around forever and all of them are in the spotlight at one time or another. Right now it is Menzerna and Meguiars M105. Before it was Optimum. Then there are other products like Poorboys that are in the background but work just as well with half the cost.

Wax is COMPLETELY based on your likes/dislikes. Most people cannot tell the difference between the $100 wax and the $20 after a few days. For ease of use, I like Poorboys Nattys blue http://autogeek.net/nattys-blue.html or Meguiars NXT 2.0. If I want something that will last a long time and that glossy wet look isnt as important, I will use Collinite 845IW or 476s, both of which can be found at Harbor Freight for less than $10. Then there are the Klasse Twins, AIO and Sealant Glaze. The twins work very well too but they are a pain in the @$$ to work with. Its all a matter of what you like.

As for a recommendation of what to use for minor correction, it depends on your budget and whether you want to get the products on the internet or locally, what do you have to work with, and how much time you want to spend.

If buying off the internet and you have no products or tools on hand, I would say buy one of the kits they have on Autogeek ( http://autogeek.net/po.html ), ADS ( http://www.autodetailingsolutions.net/c ... shers.html) , or Detailers Domain ( http://www.detailersdomain.com/index.as ... ategory=17 ). Just make sure they have the polisher, some pads, polish, and a couple of towels. All the kits will give you VERY similar results, its just a matter of cost and effort on your part. If you already have a polisher, you can use any polish that strikes your fancy, the Menz line does work well, its kind of pricey. Optimum works well and its not as expensive. And then there are Poorboys and XMT which are very similar, low cost and work just as well if the effort is put forth.

If buying locally at WalMart or an autoparts chain store, you could get a small 6 inch palm polisher, Meguiars SwirlX, whichever wax suits your fancy, and some microfiber towels for much less. Will the results be as good? Probably not but your car will look much better than it does now.

I don't recall if it was here or on the old BC, but WillWren cleaned up his cars using a ryobi polisher, Meguiars scratch x, and liquid glass and the results were pretty *dang* impressive. The main thing is to take your time and do things one section at a time. When waxing, thin layers work best and apply two layers of whichever product you use to ensure even coverage. Work in the shade on a cool surface and youre good to go.

One thing you might want to do is look at the forums on Autogeek (youll see several Pontiac Bonneville Club members there), Autopia (you need to put up with alot of BS and flaming there), Meguiars online (biased forum towards Megs, but still has alot of good info), and detailing bliss. All of the forums have similar info but they all have their product niches. In addition, look through all the threads here about detailing and both of the your rides sections, plenty of good info to get you started.

Another good writeup

Very true about me being a Menzerna fan. I try not to recommend it too much though as I haven't really tried many others. I plan on buying some more budget minded polishes this year so that I can recommend them to people that don't want to buy a $45 bottle of polish. I will still likely stick with the Menzerna though

As far as yellow vs. orange Lake Country pads, I have never used a yellow pad, though there have been several times that I wish I did have one. Here is an example of what can be done for about $350 and many hours of work. http://www.autopia.org/forum/click-brag ... shape.html That was done using an orange Lake Country pad with Menzerna Super Intensive Polish followed by a white Lake Country pad with Menzerna Micro Polish. That was topped with a Meguiar's sealant that would be much like the NXT 2.0.

One or two visits to your local detail shop for the amount of correction would easily cost $350 or more, so you can see that it is well worth the investment.
Not only that, but you could do your car more then a dozen times for that $$$

Believe me I am not knocking you for using Menz. I have seen your work and you are very good at what you do. I saw the boat thread on AG and I gotta say *dang* good work. Possibly a little crazy for trying to do that with a PC (UDM for you right?), I wouldn't have tried that without a rotary. Nor am I trying to say the Menz line is bad, they are very good and will get the job done but they are a little pricey compared to some others. For those just planning on doing their cars I don't believe it is worth the cost. For people like you and I that make some money on the side detailing, it can be justified depending on how much you make.

That said, for the people who are on a budget there are many OTC type compounds and polishes that will do the job very well. Using a palm buffer you can get much better results than you would by hand with much lower cost and I think that is what many people would be after instead of putting down $200+ on supplies that they will use once or twice.

For some of the lower cost products that are OTC, megs makes some very good polishes that work with machines and by hand. Ultimate compound, scratch x 1.0 and 2.0, swirlx and colorx by megs are all fairly good for the price. I cant say anything about the Turtle Wax or Mothers polishes as I have never used them but I would venture to guess that they are about the same, good for the price.

For those looking into the "boutique" type polishes, all the previously mentioned are good as is the 3M line. As I have said, there are no bad polishes. They all do a very similar job. It is a matter of what type of paint you are working on, what type of defects you are correcting, machine you are using, and the time you have to do the work.

The best thing to do is read on the forums that are available, ask questions to the people you trust and have the experience, and go out there and try it. You have to start somewhere and if you are really afraid of messing up your own car, try working the polish on an area that no one will see like the underside of the hood or the trunk. Once you are comfortable with that try the underside of the bumpers where it is not is plain view, then go from there. Do small sections at a time, personally I do sections about 18"x18" but you could go slightly larger or smaller from there. Do not try to polish out your entire hood in one pass as it will not come out as good.