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My original offer still stands.

Here's where I'm at: I could press on with this build, so I have 800 into the longblock, let's say a couple more hundred into headwork and valves, prob close to 1300 I've spent on gen v, northstar, intercooler stuff. Maybe more. Plus the time and effort to actually do all this work. Best case ill break my trans before the first snowfall.

Or I could sell all this crap, sell the car, scrap what doesn't sell and buy any of the dozen 04-06 GTOs for sale within 40 miles for $10000. Haven seen one with more than 70k miles either.

Well, you'll do what you want, I expect. But, $60 was all it took to get my valve seats machined on my L67 build, of course this depend on the shop.

Just because you have a l67 block means horse-**** when you have the L32 rods and heads. GM wouldn't have used up the block with the 3800 SERIES II stamping on it if it made a difference...

Honestly, with a used junkyard motor, you'd be silly to not pull the head and oil pan to check for chipped pistons and spun bearings. My motor and trans had 85k (or so, too drunk to remember ATM) and I still did a full teardown and rebuilt. It's insurance against failure: do you really want to rebuild the engine in a year or two, just to save some time now?

The only difference I remember seeing between L67 and L32 are rods. Now that you have them, roll with it!

Edit: Trans rebuilds aren't exactly difficult or rocket science. Replace the clutches and seals, and any broken parts, and you're good to go. Sounds like a good time to do it to me.
Yes, there is time involved, but the same is true for those coveted RWD platforms you're looking at. If you like your Bonnie, I say WTF not?!?

Its not just the series II vs Series III cast into the block. Early "l32s" were literally l67 longblocks, rods and all. That appears to be what I have. Im also very discouraged by the filth of what Ive seen so far. Pull the valve covers on my 175k mile motor and you wont find piles of sludge.

I planned to do an inspection but was really banking on not pulling the heads. It opens the door to so much more money to be spent. Valve job, new exh valves, guides, magnafluxing, porting.... Where do I stop? Will need head gaskets, studs, probably planing of the heads if I dont want to have the head gaskets leak in three hours.

Not to mention the time factor. By the time I get this shtbox on the road its going to be winter. Guess what happens in winter. Yeah that rot under my fuel filler door turns into a huge gaping hole.

Those RWD cars are coveted for a reason. RWD makes sense. The 6.0l GTOs came stock with as much power as Im going to all this trouble to make. And they do it reliably and deliver it to the correct end of the car.

So the question is really how badly do I want to loose my ass. Do I cut my losses, sell the pile of parts and move on? Do I do a quick swap to sell a car with no motor knock? Or do I press on with this build, have a retard-fast bonneville and keep an eye out for something thats actually good?

Another question I find myself asking is whether I should ask for a little help on the headwork from the seller of the engine? After all dont think I got what I was told I was getting, and I paid a premium for a low mile L32. I Have an l67 that needs to be torn down.

Well, you have listed your options and only you can decide.We can only offer our own personal opinions at this point and we all know what they say about opinions.....................

Mine, do the work and rebuild. Remember everyone are living in different circumstances though.

I'm leaning towards pressing on since most of the money is already spent. Need to finish rebuildin the blower today and talk to the seller of the engine to see whether he feels a partial refund is in order due to this rather irritating discovery. Ill post pics of the main bearings today.

Tore the engine down today. Pretty sure the oil was never changed. Crank might need machining, heads are nasty and the rings are pretty well pasted to the pistons.

A few pics for now...






Calling around for the headwork and block cleaning tomorrow.

This is how all the rings look.

Ick. Who did you get the motor from?

I'm not going to say for now.

That is nasty... I would be livid!

Looks like a core motor to me, sorry about your troubles

Eww. That's either a high-mileage engine, or somebody had a really heavy foot. Either way, it's been run hard and put away wet. Not good. I'd say a partial refund is in order.

Calling a head shop tomorrow to see what the valve job is going to cost. I'm going to offer the seller the option to either pay to fix what's wrong(including head gaskets, bearings that were shot and head studs)or buy back the pile of parts to use as he sees fit. Ill even donate my time spent diassembling it. Given the written claims of the year of the engine (prod date stamped on the rear cover says June 4 2003, the motor was supposed to be from an 05 gtp), its mileage and condition, all clearly refuted by the photos posted above, I feel my options are fair and reasonable for both of us.

Or am I way off base? Is it buyer beware? Should I have insisted on pulling a piston out before buying? I'm going off the assumtion that neither of us got what we expected and there was no deception intended. I'm basically going to suggest that we split the loss.

I hope its not out of line for me to be posting this but I'm not doing so in malice or to make any accusations. Just chronicaling the realities of the automotive hobby. Think of it as a reality show in novel form. Lol.

not out of line at all imo. There is no way i'd put your new cam in that...

Ill be posting progress pics tomorrow.

For now Ill say that I have gotten nothing from the seller of the junk engine. If I dont hear from him tomorrow Im going to have to switch to assuming theres a problem. I really dont want to have to litigate over a stupid V6, ya know?

Meanwhile the heads are done, blower is assembled, interior is apart.

Im drinkin, so thats all I got for now.

If you are serious about making real power....sell it all. RWD and LS is the way to go for GM. Not knocking the FWD\3800 setup, but it is what it is, just not the best platform if you wanna get serious.

I wouldnt call this "serious". Ill be around 300whp. It wasnt uncommon during the heyday of modding the 3800 for guys to daily drive 400+whp grand prix for years.

The plan here is to build a nice motor that will work for a long time. When it eats the trans Ill pull it, sell the blower, buy a fiero and a turbo and throw a party.

Working on my first cup of coffe. Ill put up some pics in a little bit.

01bonneSC wrote:If you are serious about making real power....sell it all. RWD and LS is the way to go for GM. Not knocking the FWD\3800 setup, but it is what it is, just not the best platform if you wanna get serious.

Obviously going by the old saying: "there's no replacement for displacement".



At this point it seems no matter what direction you go your gonna get screwed. It sucks that you gotta crap motor after your purchase of all the speed parts. Basically, at this point of not hearing from the seller you can figure you're not going to. It's a choice of throwing in the towel and getting screwed, or sticking with it while getting screwed and getting the car all back together and enjoying it for a bit. Then sell it after enjoying it for a bit and move on. If it'll end up on the sell it road, I'd just do a basic build and sell off the speed parts to recoup some/all of that money to put towards the rebuild. You can try going after the seller, but remember it's gonna take time and energy from you to get an outcome you MIGHT not be happy with. It boils down to a point of letting it go and moving on, or pursuing the issue to get a result thats not necessarily guaranteed.

I realize that this is MY point of view, and you'll do what you see is best for YOU.
I just wanted to throw my 2 cents at the situation.

Ill be keeping the car for a while. Its not a fix it to sell situation.

Im still hoping Marty is going to make this right but Im not particularly hopeful anymore. I wasnt asking a whole lot from him and I cant get a hold of him now.