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If you have your power wire for the amp fused, you can just pull that fuse when you hook the ground up. That way the amp isn't seeing any power at the time.

rmac694203 wrote:If you have your power wire for the amp fused, you can just pull that fuse when you hook the ground up. That way the amp isn't seeing any power at the time.

You can also just disconnect the negative battery terminal while doing any electrical work. Without a ground reference, all voltages will have no return circuit, so everything becomes an open circut, which is safe to work on.

wake wrote:you can fry your amp by grounding it to itself.

This doesn't make logical electrical sense. Your amp isn't electrically grounded until you connect the ground cable to an actual ground. You *can't* ground a device to itself if it *isn't grounded to begin with*. There's no "frying" and no short circuits that occur, because there's no ground. No ground is by definition an *open circuit*. No current flows through an open circuit, nothing can fry. I'm sure you guys had something in mind when you wrote this, but what you wrote isn't correct, and in the interest of providing accurate descriptions of electrical circuits, I'm writing this reply.

If an amp's chassis is physically bolted to a suitable electrical ground point, you could, in theory, connect the amp's electrical ground wire to that chassis point and have a workable electrical ground, but that's really just more of a coincidence that the physical mounting bolt is also an electrical ground. But ideally if you have more than one amp, or a standalone active crossover or EQ, you want to ground them to the same point, and it is far more convenient to have a separate dedicated grounding bolt for everything, than it is to combine that with a physical mounting point for any of your audio hardware. So while that could electrically work, just don't do it.

wake wrote:IMO use the extra wire to ground the amp directly to the batter..then you have a perfect circuit..and youll get a little cleaner notes..not to mention less voltage drop

psburtis wrote:i would suggest grounding to one of the 2 bolts holding the amp in place

this is NOT a good idea...at all..you can fry your amp by grounding it to itself..

also seat belts can be used yes..but its better to go for something a little stronger...also depends on the wattage of the amp..if its anything under 500 your usually pretty good with the seat belts...but i still dont use them

This is a myth. Ground is ground. As long as the amp is grounded already, there is no potential issue by also grounding the wire to the same point. You cannot FRY an amp by grounding the chassis and ground lead to the same point on the car. This myth likely started when a low-quality amp grounded in this manner caused distortion and noise in the subs because of a poorly chassis-grounded (internal) situation in the amp. But you cannot FRY an amp by doing this. Frying an amp consists of overloading the output.

im not going to argue

Argue if you like, but this is one of the most basic principles of electricity, electronics, and amplifiers. To fry an amplifier, you need to have a problem on the output (load) side of the circuit. A bad ground will prevent the amp from working or cause distortion/noise, but will not fry the amplifier circuit unless there's a more major design flaw in the device to begin with.

Bill is correct. I've repaired many hundreds of amplifiers. Amplifiers blow because of a short or near-short on the output, which occurs through either mistakes in installation wiring, accidents, using lower impedance speakers than an amp is rated for, or driving speakers that have a shorted speaker coil from overdriving them. If you're lucky, your amp is equipped with an output short-circuit protection circuit, but even then those often blow. I've seen plenty of amps with destroyed protection circuits, but many many more with blown outputs. Car amps have switching power supplies, and those circuits can fail too, but in practice those tend to be pretty foolproof, and I can't recall ever having to repair one outside of an occasional transformer replacement.

There are MANY myths and misconceptions floating around the 'audio' world. The reason for them is that while there are some REALLY knowledgeable people in that industry, there are a whole *shoot*-pot of uneducated un-trained people in the industry as well. Half the Autozone stores and Audio shops in our wonderful world are staffed by these people. The most dangerous person in the world is the person that THINKS they know something and don't.

This amp frying issue is a prime example. There are probably a ton of people out there that believe this to be true (I've heard it before this), but anyone with any education or experience in amplifiers will tell you otherwise. An amplifier is an amplifier is an amplifier. Whether it's the audio amp in your cellular phone or the amp in the trunk of your car. Same principals and components, different scale. Bottom line, take anything you hear with a grain of salt. I'm not sure where this amp frying from a poor ground idea came from, but I've heard it too many times.

Get a poor ground on an amp, the amp might stop working, but it sure isn't going to fry unless it was assembled by a 6 year old in a Chinese factory on the night shift.

willwren wrote:Get a poor ground on an amp, the amp might stop working, but it sure isn't going to fry unless it was assembled by a 6 year old in a Chinese factory on the night shift.

haha, well, there you have it. makes sense to me.

The problem with Audio stores and Autozone stores (and similar jobs) is that they're typically entry-level jobs that stay at the bottom level, and don't have room for advancement. Turnover rates are high. By the time someone starts developing the smarts and experience, they're replaced by a dumber model.

If the person gets an education, they move on. So 99% of your Autozone front counter guys have nothing more than a High School education, and are under 20 years old. How much experience do they have? Same holds true in many cases at audio stores, but the average age is a bit higher. Again, most have no college. Some installers have certifications from any one of half-a-dozen institutions, but those certs are very specialized in terms of installing, and a good many of those certified guys don't really understand how an amplifier is designed, built, or fails. They're VERY good at installing or troubleshooting to the root cause (failed component), but not much more.

In both categories, you have a bunch of 'younger' guys that think they know it all, or saw it once and figured that's the way it always is. I know, I was there at some point in my life, as was nearly everyone here.

And this is where many of the misconceptions in the Audio world come from. Bragging rights come from the biggest cap, lowest number gauge for a power feed, or most monstrous gauge of speaker wire. In reality, most instances mentioned on these three things are way overkill for the application. Things get even worse when guys start upgrading to an alternator WAY too big for their needs just for the bragging rights. And the list goes on and on.

Look at the quality installations from qualified people, and you won't SEE the cap, the fuse, or the cables. The point they make is quality sound, not bragging rights over who's d i c k is bigger.

Where do I get this from? Crappy advice from teenagers at Autozone for years, and a very close association with a couple local Audio shops over the past 5 years. Very good installer, and a very knowledgeable owner/salesman. I've worked side-by-side with them for a long time. My education and degrees (and experience in industry for the last 25 years) put me in a good position to be a good judge. Contrast that to the stereo store down the street? It's a flat-out JOKE. They sell you what has the higher profit, regardless of quality or what you ask for. Their installations aren't clean on purpose. It's all about showing the biggest wire, cap, or fuse.

agreed. the only advice i ever ask is from people who i know have experience in doing things right, or audio specialists, such as Crutchfield customer support.